This post is in response to a comment from Ed from the UK on my Debunking Douglas Dietrich post. Ed said:
Just a quick note. Yes, Dietrich is a sloppy researcher, and no doubt a complete bullshit artist, but this claim – “The FBI have now declassified that Hitler lived on for years in South America.” shows you to be fairly sloppy yourself. Read the FBI document – it says nothing like you claim, but merely reports on an allegation that cannot be verified. Seriously, such standards of research are woeful
This comment has some signatures of a Troll attack. In particular, the logical fallacy of Red Herring “oh you said something that I say isn’t true, that means the rest of your work is probably untrue also”. They are attacking the Grammar with sophistry.
Here’s what I said:
CLAIM #3: THE US DID NOT WIN WORLD WAR 2 AND OCCUPY JAPAN AND GERMANY.
Some claim the “Thousand Year Reich” plan of the Nazis is still running. The FBI have now declassified that Hitler lived on for years in South America. Others argue that the US had foreknowledge of Pearl Harbor and allowed it to happen, as was discussed in Claim #1. Mr Dietrich’s not making those arguments. He claims WW2 started long before Pearl Harbor or Hitler’s invasion of Poland, and Japan won the 17-year war with indestructible bio-warfare balloons. America surrendered to Japan after we wiped out their Navy, dropped two nukes on Hiroshima and Nagasaki and firebombed Tokyo.
His theory is not supported by other historians. To be clear, I believe the US was the winner in World War 2, and Japan and Germany lost.
As you can see, the words in question link to the now declassified Hitler file in the FBI vault. The file is not a single document, but in fact 4 parts. Part 1 is 203 pages, Part 2 is 179 pages, Part 3 is 221 pages, and Part 4 is 139 pages. The idea that I should have to read the entirety of 749 pages of blurry and redacted documents just to hyperlink to them from a free blog is preposterous, especially given that commercial outfits like the New York Times and Washington Post are not held to anywhere near that standard. Click the link or the picture and you will go to the FBI documents where you can read for yourself.
The context of this so-called sloppy hyperlink was introducing Mr Dietrich’s “Renegade History” World War 2 claims by contrasting them with 3 of the most credible shadow history theories that relate to World War II: the Thousand Year/Fourth Reich, Hitler Escaped, and the US Knew About Pearl Harbor in Advance. This is what makes Mr Ed’s comment a Red Herring. The FBI declassifying their files on Hitler has nothing to do with the veracity of any claims made in the original post, or indeed anywhere else on this site.
Leaving that aside, I stand by the wording of the link: the FBI had information that Hitler lived on for years in South America, which has now been declassifiied. This was something that was long suspected in the
conspiracy para-politics world. Thanks to the FBI data dump, we now have hundreds of reports that he survived, and some that appear to have been taken quite seriously saying that he went to South America. It is far from a single report in a single document from a possibly suspect source that “merely reports on an allegation that cannot be verified“, as Mr Ed alleges.
Here’s what the FBI themselves say, at the introduction to their Hitler section:
Adolph Hitler (1889-1945) was leader of the National Socialist (Nazi) Party and Chancellor of Germany from 1933-1945; he led that country into World War II in 1939. The documents in this file range from 1933 to 1947, but primarily fall either in 1933 or between 1945 and 1947. In 1933, the FBI investigated an assassination threat made against Hitler. In the aftermath of Germany’s surrender in 1945, western Allied forces suspected that Hitler had committed suicide but did not immediately find evidence of his death. At the time, it was feared that Hitler may have escaped in the closing days of the war, and searches were made to determine if he was still alive. FBI Files indicate that the Bureau investigated some of the rumors of Hitler’s survival.
Straight away you will see that his death was suspect from the beginning, there’s hardly any evidence of it, and the FBI took very seriously the possibility that Hitler lived on past World War II. The files are full of reports supporting that, with only a couple to the contrary. Despite all the investigations, neither the FBI nor any of the rest of the Western Allied forces have ever found any evidence of his death. Unless you think “he told people he was going to commit suicide” is evidence.
The FBI archivists have kindly put one of the biggest “smoking gun” reports on Hitler from the Vault up front as the very first pages of Part 1:
Sure, it’s hearsay; but that’s how the FBI operates. They collect reports from informants. This particular report is pretty detailed, but it is by no means the only document in the files relevant to Hitler’s escape.
There are scores, maybe hundreds, of reported sightings in these documents, mostly in North or South America. Admittedly, some appear to be from kooks – but can we really judge any eyewitness report to be false just because it sounds implausible? For example, one source was reported to be “highly intoxicated”. One drunk guy calling the FBI saying he saw Hitler in the donut shop doesn’t automatically prove Hitler died in the bunker. In the case of the South America information, there is much more than a single sighting, and the different reports corroborate each other. In the case of the official history, the evidence is weak, circumstantial, and contradictory.
Not Just The FBI
Documents in the Vault show it wasn’t only the FBI investigating Hitler sightings. The CIA was too. Interestingly, out of all the reported sightings, it is only those related to Hitler being in South America that the CIA seem to take an interest in. More recently, CIA bad ass Bob Baer (the real life guy George Clooney played in Syriana) led a team of professional investigators analyzing the 2014 FBI data dump, and concluded:
Using a collection of never-before-seen documents, the team claim to have proof Hitler did not kill himself in his underground bunker at the end of the Second World War.
Instead, the investigators believe Hitler faked his own death before scarpering to the Canary Islands to live out his days in the sunshine.
CIA veteran Bob Baer said: “The narrative the government gives us is a lie. if you look at the FBI files it throws open the investigation.
“What we are doing is re-examining history, history that we thought was settled that Hitler died in the bunker but the deeper we get into it, it’s clear to me we don’t have any facts for it.”
The team have access to 700 pages of newly declassified information, with one document stating: “American Army officials in Germany have not located Hitler’s body nor is there any reliable source that Hitler is dead.”
It wasn’t just the Western Allied forces that suspected Hitler escaped. The Russians thought so too.
“Overwhelming” circumstantial evidence? I find the circumstantial evidence here to overwhelmingly point to his escape.
In fact, there seems to be more evidence that Hitler lived, than there is that he committed suicide in the bunker in Berlin.
Limited And Conflicting Eyewitness Testimony Points to a Cover-Up
Linge, Hitler’s personal valet has another story again:
That would be the Heinz Linge that told the Wehrmacht surgeon-general, Major-General Walter Schreiber, while he was interned for several years in two Soviet POW camps in Strausberg and Posen and had a chance to speak to him about events in the bunker, that he –
“…did NOT see Hitler, but toward the end noticed two bodies wrapped in carpet being carried out of the bunker”….
And Kempka later told a different story:
Erich Kempka made a statement to American interrogator George R. Allen, the counterintelligence officer of the 101st Airborne. In it, Kempka gave the Americans their first eyewitness account of any of the events connected with the death of the Fuehrer. He said that on 30th of April—although he felt unable to say that this was the date “with complete sureness” – But he COULD say that at “precisely” 2.30pm, Guensche called him at the Reich Chancellery garage, asking him to bring five cans of petrol to the bunker. There Guensche told him that Hitler was dead and that he had been ordered to burn the corpse “so that he would not be exhibited at a Russian freak-show”. Kempka said he then helped carry the corpses; while Linge and an orderly whom he did not remember were carrying the corpse of Hitler, he carried the corpse of Eva Hitler. Kempka simply assumed that the corpse he had seen Linge carrying was Hitler’s, for he noticed “the long black trousers and the black shoes which the Fuehrer usually wore with his field-gray uniform jacket”….
Axmann says that Goebbels led him into the room, where they surveyed the death scene for 15 minutes before Goebbels sent him to get the blankets. Then Kempka moved the bodies out. Kempka says that he heard two gunshots, and saw two bodies being carried out with blankets on them instantly. And then later he says he didn’t hear any shots, and found out about the deaths at precisely 2:30 at the garage, from Guensche. So basically the two main witnesses who survived have wildly conflicting stories. Axmann says the bodies were covered so that guards in the outer areas couldn’t identify them. The only other witness is a guard from the outer area. Kempka says he could only identify the body by the boots.
Of the witnesses only Goebbels and Axmann saw Hitler dead without a blanket over his face (Axmann says Linge did, Linge says he didn’t). Goebbels and his six kids supposedly committed suicide the next day with cyanide capsules. Bormann died at the Chancellory bunker site too.
FBI Documentation Suggesting the Escape
First-hand testimony from the pilot who flew the Hitlers out to Denmark
Here’s the British Intelligence report that the military seems to have adopted as gospel, but was obviously questioned by both the CIA and FBI since they continued to investigate it for many years. They admit up front that it is “largely based on eyewitness accounts” but they don’t cover any of the problems with the eyewitness testimony. Officially, there were no eyewitnesses to the murder-suicide; just the aftermath.
Photos of Hitler in Later Life
Forensic Evidence Doesn’t Match; Bodies, Cremation Never Found
A few years ago they did forensic testing on the remains (taken from the site by the Russians) which proved it was not Adolf Hitler. The skull fragment was from someone 5 inches shorter, and a woman. At the time of the World War 2, burned bodies could be identified through dental records – nobody would have ever dreamed of DNA or other modern forensic techniques. Someone reported to be Eva Braun checked in to the hospital for dental X-Rays a short time before the deaths. This may have been Eva’s body double, killed in her stead.
Archaeological digs at the bunker site did not produce any evidence of the cremation, according to a 1949 report; but charred corpses were found there by the Russians. The remains – later discredited by the skull fragment – were all destroyed. Why?
Both corpses were covered in blankets before being carried out of the apartment. They could only be identified by their footwear. They were taken to the garden outside the bunker, placed in a bomb crater with their dogs and some identifiying trinkets, then doused with 40 or 50 gallons of gasoline and burned. This was a specific plan that Hitler went out of his way to let people know would be going on before he supposedly ended it.
The description of how the bodies were found is all very convenient:
Several days later, a Soviet soldier found the half-charred bodies of a man and a woman buried inside a shell crater near the bunker’s emergency exit. He’d noticed the tip of a gray blanket peeking out from the crater, which matched descriptions–produced by interrogating the few aides who remained in the bunker–of the blanket in which Hitler and Eva Braun’s corpses had been wrapped. The bodies were accompanied by two dogs, later identified as Hitler’s beloved Blondi and one of her pups. Surrounding the dead were several dark-colored medicine phials, pages of handwriting, money, and a metal medallion that read, “Let me be with you forever.”
It should have been a no-brainer to get a forensic match on those blanket-wrapped corpses. But how come the gray blankets didn’t burn when they had been doused with 50 gallons of gasoline? That sounds like a lot. How come the corpses were only half-charred? Perhaps they were fire-proof blankets, so chosen to assist in the later location of the bodies.
This forensic evidence does not in itself prove Hitler escaped. The fact remains that after multiple archaeological digs at the bunker which have located at least 14 corpses, the remains of Hitler and Eva Braun have never been found. Just some teeth and some small jaw fragments, which supposedly the Russians have locked up in the KGB archive. A 1972 dig found a body that DNA testing in 1998 proved was Martin Bormann. But any DNA evidence for the Hitlers is still missing after 70 years.
The Russians blocked out the excavations of the bunker, claiming documents had gone missing. The Western Allies were only able to get into a smaller area of the complex, which was filled with water hampering any investigation.
In May 1945 the Russians declared that Hitler had been poisoned; it’s hard to say how they could have done toxicology on the charred corpses. Possibly biting into a cyanide capsule leaves traces in the teeth that don’t get removed by fire.
Many Conflicting Stories About the Teeth
Supposedly the Russians could positively identify the remains of the pair from their teeth, however there are at least 4 conflicting versions of this story. The Russians found fragments of jaw and teeth amongst 14 charred corpses when they excavated the bunker site which had been heavily bombed. They managed to track down a dental assistant who had worked on Hitler. She was able to draw sketches from memory of Hitler’s terrible teeth. He had almost his entire mouth replaced by the end of the war. His dentist Hugo Blaschke was later captured by the Americans, but as far as I can tell he never inspected the teeth and jaw fragments. Hitler’s dental records were supposedly removed in the same Börnersdorf JU-353 plane crash that the discredited Hitler Diaries emerged from. Martin Bormann’s secretary Else Kruger was reportedly killed in this plane crash because her baggage was found in the plane. However she lived on and married a British intelligence officer. Several cargo boxes were retrieved from the crash site and removed. The Hitler Diaries could have been a limited hangout psy-op to cover the tracks of the escape story with a high-profile hoax.
I’m no dentist, but none of these pictures looks like the other to me. What do you think?
At the end of his life Hitler only had 5 original teeth, all the others had been replaced with porcelain crowns. I count way more than 5 awful teeth in the picture.
The pictures above came from Historian at Large who has a great article about the teeth. The Russians say that they had this X-Ray in May 1945, when they verified teeth and bone fragments against the previously drawn sketch from memory by the dental assistants. However the dental assistant led them to a mildewed old dental office in Hitler’s bunker to produce the X-Ray(s). Why didn’t his dentist have it? Why did the dentist flee, but the assistant (his fiancee) stay to lead the Russians to this evidence?
Further complicating the story is the evidence chain of the teeth. A young Jewish girl in the Russian Army, Yelena Kagan, from a wealthy Moscow family, was given the teeth in a red jewelry box for safekeeping. She didn’t know where they came from. And then she serendipitiously manages to be the one who locates the dental assistant and X-Rays as well, thus proving the whole case that Hitler was dead. WTF? This sounds like a Roger Rabbit Narrative.
There are other conflicting reports, such as this paper in the Journal of Dental Problems and Solutions saying that both Hausermann and dental prosthesist Fritz Echtmann were arrested on May 9, 1945. Hausermann got 10 years in the gulag and Echtmann got 9. On this same date, Hausermann verified the teeth in a hospital where they were still attached to the cadaver. This added a picture of Hitler’s mandible to the mix.
On the afternoon of May 8, the commission handed over a red box to the Smersh. It contained jawbones and gold bridges from bodies n°12 and 13 who were suspected to be Hitler’s and Eva Braun’s. This box was handed over to the interpreter.
The following day, the Smersh were looking for Hugo Blaschke, his dental prosthetist and his assistant. At the clinic of Kurfürstendamm, they found out that the dentist had left Berlin for Berchtesgaden under the Führer’s command on April 19. However, they succeeded in taking in the two others for questioning.
They were asked about the content of the red box which was shown to them. All that they said was immediately recorded before they had the chance to examine the human remains.
On May 10, the Smersh sent a report to Moscow. It concluded that the two remaining bodies had been identified as Hitler and Eva Braun’s remains .
The red box and its content were sent back to the Soviet capital.
In this version of the story, the dental assistant and prosthetist never examined the remains which appeared to have the mandible intact. They were shown the red box and its contents, said “yes that’s Hitler”. Case closed. No mention of the X-Ray. And how big was this box to contain jawbones? Why were these teeth fragments separated from the cadaver(s) in the first place?
If it was Hitler’s double in the bunker, it would have been easy to take him to the special dental office for X-Rays.
The dental assistant drew a picture of Hitler’s teeth, and then the technician confirmed the picture. According to Dr Mark Benecke:
The actual identification of Hitler’s remains (and therefore the confirmation of his death based on physical evidence) was published in 1972. It was performed by comparing the teeth of the remains to the dental schemata drawn by Hitler’s dentist.
The picture matched the bone fragments in the red jewellery box, and the X-ray that the dental assistant would later lead the Russians to. Which came first? It seems that with her skills (presumably these are the finest dentists in Germany if not the world) she would be able to draw a sketch from an X-Ray. Why weren’t the X-Rays used in 1972?
Who was interpreting the match of the X-Ray, the teeth, and the fragments? Was it Soviet dental technicians? Or was it actually Hausermann and Echtmann:
The location of his crowns and a sawn-through upper left bridge matched the teeth in the jewelry box, but Rzhevskaya’s team needed further proof. Hausermann led them to a tiny, mildewed dental office in Hitler’s bunker, where she produced Hitler’s dental x-rays. The images–the placement of root canal fillings, sites of bone breakdown, and unusual bridges–confirmed that the body found in the rubble outside the chancellery had belonged to Hitler. A dental technician named Fritz Echtmann, who had worked in the same laboratory as Hausermann and created crowns and bridges for both Hitler and Eva Braun, verified the findings.
A double could have had crowns attached and partial sawing and metal bridges put in the same places as Hitler, then X-Rays taken – easily justified to the dupe by saying “you have to look alike”. Note that it’s the guy who made the crowns for Hitler and Eva verifying the findings.
Many Nazis Escaped to South America
The Nazis exploited “ratlines“, tied to the Vatican which has had a huge presence in South America since the New World was discovered, to smuggle people and valuables out of Europe. More than 9000 high-level Nazis relocated to South America this way. In fact South America was described as a “haven” for Nazis. America got our share, more than 1500 through PAPERCLIP which became the guts of NASA and our aerospace industry, as well as MKULTRA. Russia also took a large number of Nazi scientists (7000).
There was a quite famous Nazi pedophile colony in Chile called Colonia Dignidad, since renamed Villa Bavieria.
There are about 50 U-Boats still unaccounted for, which lends credence to the theory that Nazis used them to flee to the ends of the earth. At least two of the U-Boats showed up in South America.
Nietzche’s brother-in-law tried to start an Aryan colony in Paraguay, but committed suicide.
If Hitler was to escape to anywhere, it would make sense that he would go to where the largest number of his people were; and if the Nazis were to escape to anywhere, it would make sense for them to follow the Fuhrer.
The idea that Hitler lived on after World War II is not limited to just me and the FBI and CIA. There have been a number of well researched books on the topic:
A couple of documentaries are available on Amazon Prime, Adolph Hitler’s Great Escape and Hitler’s Escape to Argentina.
It’s also the subject of a History Channel series Hunting Hitler, where Baer’s CIA team
used sonar, historical maps and cutting-edge technology as well as interviewing a series of alleged witnesses to the crazed dictator’s escape. Hitler easily faked his own death through the use of double, say the team, who add the corpse found by the Russians was actually five inches shorter than Hitler with a smaller skull.
I hate to say I told you so…OK, I confess, actually I love it #thankstrump
Benito Mussolini worked for British MI5 during WWI as a journalist. Just so happens only British intelligence backed the Hitler death story? Sounds like Hitler was a British agent like the other fascist dictator Mussolini.
I’ve just watched one of the Amazon Prime ones, Hitler’s Great Escape with Harey Cooper. I challenge anyone skeptical of this story to watch that documentary and tell me this guy doesn’t know what he’s talking about after 30 years of studying it and being at the sites and hearinf first hand testimony. He also covers the Thousand Year Reich and Antarctics Base theories.
The Moonies were a biggest, most visible cult in the 70s, of course the Suicide Club would pick them to infiltrate. And the Nazis, well shit, why not? I’m truly, truly baffled that a person who knows what the Suicide Club was about would think there was a “sub rosa” connection there. Artists (and I think the Suicide Club were absolutely artists) work with what’s out there.
As for the picture of Crimson with arms raised, come on dude. That’s just human anatomy. When I was teaching I’d often raise my arms when making a large point, was I also engaging in a Satanic ritual? Satanists are humans with human bodies, so of course their ritualistic gestures will resemble ones used by other groups as well as just humans in general.
JV I hereby pronounce you the Snopes of Burners.me
When you were teaching, was it inside a pentagram as a giant effigy was about to be burned in a mass public ritual? That commenced with your arm gesture, then made arm gestures of its own…with both gestures being from magic books of Aleister Crowley?
Because if so, that would’ve been one HELL of a class.
In 8 hours The Man burns! Er… I mean… Hitler’s Torch burns!
Your claims that Larry Harvey is the illegitimate son of Hitler are not well supported. Clearly an evaluation of teeth could help your argument:
As for the direct influence of Hitler, what does he have to do with 100,000 people gathering to admire a flame? It’s not like he had anything to do with things like the Olympic pageantry and torch – try to keep this blog tied to current events, man.
And don’t forget: Always have an exit strategy…
Wow. I was under the impression that this blog used to be about Burning Man. If you read this piece, it appears that the burning man in question might have been Adolf Hitler.
Seems I stumbled onto a crackpot conspiracy site. My mistake.
Bye! I’ve updated the post with some more connections to Burning Man, since this is obviously very important to some of our readers.
It’s good to question history, but let us never forget that 6 trillion Jews died in WWII.
Six trillion seems high. I thought it was 5 trillion. Do you have any evidence to support your number?
All the hair, I guess.
Isn’t all those FBI files you linked to just the database of all information submitted to the FBI. There is like 800 files about Bigfoot and a few thousand Elvis sightings also. If someone reports anything, they log it and file it. It is not proof of anything or nothing. Just logged reports given to them by anyone who submits something.
No, there is much more than that in the Hitler vault.
Paging Geraldo Rivera…
Wow, weird topic for Burning Man culture? Intriguing but not what I would have expected. Not being judgmental, just surprised.
It’s all connected, as I point out at the end.
huh, thought this blog used to be about the playa
You’re welcome to write a guest post